Re: A tale of two (or three) cities

Re: A tale of two (or three) cities

Hi Peter,

Actually, lists similar to the one you posted have been circulating around for years. I had that information in my possession at least 10 years ago.  I did modify and use the list you posted because it was right there in front of us.  That list could be expanded considerably.

To answer your question – No, I am not an inhabitant on PlanetPreterist.com.

The wonderful thing about Revelation is how it lends itself to so many scenarios - throughout time.  I think the imagery lends itself to Rome as well as Jerusalem, but also to world economic/political systems in general - so I see a futurist dimension to the imagery as well.  One day the whole system will come crashing down - to resounding angelic choirs singing the hallelujah chorus from Handel’s Messiah. Tickets available through lastminute.com” 

While Revelation may “lend itself well to many scenarios, it is only about one and that one is the Destruction of Jerusalem, the victory of the Son of God, the identity of the Children of God and their crossing into the promised land by the resurrection and rapture of 1Corinthians 15:23, 51- 53; cf. 1Thessalonians 4:16-17.

That having been said let me also say that I agree with you that “one day the whole system will come crashing down…”

You asked, “When are you going to give us the full version of ‘the kingdom’ - as seen from your interpretive standpoint?”

I did not know that anyone was interested.  To give you “the full version of ‘the kingdom’” as I see it would take a small book and I have not written that yet.  Perhaps we could begin here with a thumb nail sketch.  (please remember that this is a brief sketch of my understanding which is not fully develop as yet, therefore, it is subject to change as these things are clarified by additional study which includes interaction with others like you, Andrew, etc.)

As I understand what the Bible says about the kingdom – it was first promised to Abraham, and then the details of that promised kingdom were given by Samuel and other prophets.  Thus one might say that basically the OT is the record of the details of promises about the kingdom while the NT is the record of the fulfillment of those details of that promised kingdom.

Within the NT we find many references to this promised kingdom in the "kingdom of God," the "kingdom of heaven," the "kingdom of Christ" and several derivatives such as "His kingdom," "His heavenly Kingdom," the "kingdom of our Lord," etc.

Most, but certainly not all, students of the Bible assume that all these appellations are just different references to the same kingdom and do not give these appellations any further thought.  While I agree that these various appellations are in fact different appellation references to the same kingdom; I think that a specific distinction is intended by the various biblical authors.  In my opinion, the appellation the "kingdom of God" is intended to be a statement about the one that is going to establish the kingdom.  Daniel 2:44 states, "…the God of heaven shall set up a kingdom, i.e. "the kingdom of God."

While the appellations; "the kingdom of heaven" and "His heavenly kingdom" are intended by the authors Matthew and Paul to be specific references to the location of the kingdom, i.e. in heaven.

Finally, the appellations "the kingdom of Christ," "His kingdom," and the "kingdom of our Lord" are intended as declarations of the one who is to rule/reign in the kingdom, i.e. Jesus Christ.

John the Baptist began the fulfillment by preaching, “repent ye for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.  The balance of the NT records more description of this kingdom, its time of actual establishment, etc.

As I understand the fulfillment of the kingdom as given in the NT which correlates with the promises in the OT – the coming of the kingdom was preached from John until the Parousia of Jesus Christ ca. 70 AD which is when the kingdom was established by the resurrection rapture of the first century saints and their re-union with Him in the “heavenly kingdom” which God had established for Him and His bride.  Christ and His bride presently rules in that heavenly kingdom.

While this may be subject to change with additional study, at present I am inclined to think that the bride of Christ was the redemption of Israel which in the 8th century BC had been “scattered” among and “swallowed up” by the gentiles (Hosea 8:8, et al.) while the first century non-Israelite gentile believers and the first century Jewish believers were the guests invited to the wedding (cf. Hosea 2:14-23; Matthew 22:2-14; 2Cor 11:2).

It appears that the wedding was consummated by the time of the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 AD.

The heavenly kingdom rules over the earthly portion of the greater kingdom and each person from 70 AD until the present and beyond who believes and dies in Christ is immediately resurrected (metamorphosed) into the heavenly kingdom to be with Jesus, his bride, and the others who are presently there in "spiritual bodies. "

All prophecy relative to the establishment of the kingdom has been fulfilled.  This would include all prophecy in the NT, including Revelation with the exception of a few verses in 1Corinthians 15, the first sentence of Revelation 20:5 and all of 20:7-15.  The events described in these passages will be fulfilled sometime in our future (this is the time which you describe above as “one day the whole system will come crashing down…”).

By that time Jesus Christ shall have subdued all His enemies, put down all other rule, all other authority, all other power, and He will then deliver up the kingdom to God, even the Father that God may be all in all.

Prophecy and realism By: kingjames1 (51 replies) 24 January, 2006 - 03:20