Thanks to all who have contributed thus far.  All of your comments seem wel thought and have contributed much.  For ease, I am going to address this to all four commentors thus far, so I don’t have to respond four different times.

Mr. Wilkinson - I defintely agree with the traditions of the past possibly having an enormous influence upon, and being an enormous reason for, a canon.  I too believe that the standards have already been set, but I am merely trying to search for them in the same way that Noah, Shem, Abraham, Isaac, Israel, Job, etc…had to. They didn’t have a "Bible" as we know it (at least from the history we know of presently) to refer back to when questioned about matters of doctrine and faith.  So clearly they had something else that could stand as a foundation for them to build their faith upon.  So they could build with faith and confidence knowing that they were building a temple pleasing to God.  I also agree that Yahweh is in control of His word, and could have DEFINITELY used the "objects of His wrath to make better known His grace to the objects of His mercy". 

By seeking criteria outside of the established canon we are forced to not just believe what anyone tells us, and seek diligently the face of God.  A biblical example would be that of Abraham in Gen. 26:5 which states that Abraham kept Yahweh’s charge, commandments, statues, and laws…and all this without the Torah as we know it having been written.  How?  How did he know what the laws, commandments, and statutes of God were?  Did he have some written document to which to refer, or were the laws, commandments, and statutes of God just so clearly known in that time that anyone could follow them (unlikely - Chaldeans)? 

I must say that I disagree with your statements about what the Bible (or the various books within) claims for itself (themselves).  Malachi 3:6 says, "For I, YHWH, do not change;" even if the compilation of the Bible itself is not timeless, the truth within, if given by God, must be.  Yahweh does not change, neither do His standards of righteousness and holiness.  Psalm 119:142 - "Your righteousness is an everlasting righteousness, and Your law is truth."  The books themselves might not be an earthly copy of a heavenly original, but the books (specifically Torah) instruct copies of heavenly things to be made.  The Ten Commandments are placed inside of the Ark of the Covenant, which is a type of the heavenly Ark (or throne) before which our Lord now ministers as High Priest.  This Ark is also shown again in Revelation.  Could the heavenly Ark also contain the heavenly Commandments?  And the laws contained within the Torah are definitely taken as, an written down as "the words of God spoken to man". 

I do agree with your assessment of what the Bible is though.  Especially about the central narrative part.  Although I would like to throw another thing out there that I brought up on another forum.  What is the constant thread throughout the OT and NT that all are petitioned to come back to?  What were the tribes of Israel constantly slack and rebellious to which caused them much pain, grief and sorrow?  What is also constantly exalted and held to the highest place throughout the entire Bible by all contributors thereto?  The LAW of YAHWEH.  It was, is, and will be the standard of righteousness, and the truth.  Yahshua was the living breathing example of the Law lived perfectly, to the spirit and the letter.  Could the standards (criteria) of canonicity be contain also therein? 

Phil – In brief summation, I wholeheartedly agree with what you have stated.  As I have said previously, Yahweh is in control of everything.   It is definitely not outside the scope of His power to direct and guide even those who are rebellious towards Him, to accomplish His plans.  The canon we currently have could very well have been the result of His power working in that way.  The main point that I am trying to get back to is, what are His criteria for determining what is and what is NOT of Him.  Back to Job, Isaac, Abraham…how did they know what was pleasing to Yahweh?  The people of like faith as us, namely Christianity, has been numbered of upwards of 30,000 denominations.  Thirty THOUSAND!!  And there are canons ranging from 5 books (the Samaritan Bible) to 87 (the Ethiopian Orthodox Church)!  How, with so much DIVISION present TODAY in the church over beliefs & doctrines, did Abraham and others stay united in the TRUE faith, and that without ANY BIBLE?!?  We have a “solid” canon, and we can’t even agree, yet those who we read about within our canon all knew the same God, and the same standards and laws that He commanded.  That is where I am trying to get to.

Albannach – As a believer and follower of Messiah Yahshua, I am not seeking to make this a non-Christian forum.  I am seeking other people in the like faith, who may have had the same topic come up in their walk, who could pour some wisdom upon me.  From a “ministry to others” standpoint, we should not take the stance of just saying, “Well it’s the Bible, and its been around for 2000 something years, and it’s the truth.”  In my missions/evangelism experience, that is not enough to reach those who are more “intellectual”.  Most, and I do say MOST, people will accept faith Yahshua when told about the free gift of salvation offered through his blood.  Especially in poorer countries, where hearing that anything is free is foreign.  And hearing that Yahshua will not only forgive them their sins, but bring joy and peace into their lives, brings burly grown men to their knees in thankfulness and tears.  But what about the hearts of those who are content?  What about those in the United States?  A place where we have an abundance, and peoples hearts are cold because of their contentment and satisfaction?  That is who I seek an answer for as well, not only myself.

PastorPete – I also wholeheartedly agree with your assessment.  The spirit of Yahweh can definitely confirm or deny anything that we are told.  The problem still lies in explaining all the denominations of Christianity…All of them think they are in the truth, and all of them believe they are being led by the Holy Spirit.   Yet there different beliefs on almost every possible topic, and all still call themselves the “Body of Christ”.  I ask, Is Christ divided against himself.  I mean take baptism for example.  Some believe a simple sprinkling will do it, others believe that if your toenail is sticking out 1/16 of an inch you haven’t been “fully immersed”, and still others believe that baptism is non-essential to salvation, others believe it is absolutely necessary.  And all this supposedly from the same Bible, all confirmed to each by the same Holy Spirit?  (I am anti-denominational, can you tell?)  The brutally apparent division in the Body of Christ is by far our hugest weakness, and the world sees it pasted on every TV screen and newspaper.  I feel convicted about our division all the time. And I eagerly desire our unity in the faith.  So back to the topic…how can this be possible without first establishing a truthful, reliable canon, from which we can teach/correct/rebuke/train in all matters of the faith…and how can that canon be established without first having a clear set of criteria by which to compare the multiplicity of writings out there?

I eagerly await all of your comments and fruits of your study.  Thank you all again for all the time you dedicate to this post and this site in general.  For me, it is great to be able to “air out” my mind to those who can give an informed and thoughtful response.  Blessings to all in Messiah Yahshua, especially on this Sabbath day!

—-knght4yshua