Slavery and Self Control.
A committed monogamous homosexual versus a slave owner By: paulhartigan (45 replies) 6 March, 2005 - 21:02
- Re: A committed monogamous homosexual versus a slave owner By: gmanon (25/01/2010 - 22:36)
- Re: A committed monogamous homosexual versus a slave owner By: arevans74 (21/01/2010 - 17:06)
- Re: A committed monogamous homosexual versus a slave owner By: Tammy Ricks (10/12/2009 - 19:19)
- Re: A committed monogamous homosexual versus a slave owner By: joeAnne (10/01/2009 - 15:32)
- Re: A committed monogamous homosexual versus a slave owner By: Tiara79 (29/11/2009 - 07:46)
- Re: A committed monogamous homosexual versus a slave owner By: Cilionelle (25/03/2006 - 19:03)
- Taking experience seriously By: Lawrence (30/06/2005 - 23:21)
- Re: Taking experience seriously By: Cilionelle (25/03/2006 - 19:11)
- Inconsistency of the condemnation of homosexuality By: paulhartigan (01/07/2005 - 09:29)
- Notwithstanding, the Word of God remains the same By: Soldier3001 (05/07/2005 - 16:45)
- I'm not ignoring your recent By: Ivan Latham (03/04/2005 - 05:04)
- Bait and switch, red herring By: Soldier3001 (29/06/2005 - 21:09)
- ahhh, sweet grey By: mars-hill (30/06/2005 - 03:15)
- Bait and switch, red herring By: Soldier3001 (29/06/2005 - 21:09)
- Even worse, they're re-crucifying Christ By: (02/04/2005 - 02:04)
- Adam and Eve By: paynedaniel (29/06/2005 - 05:37)
- I am astounded at the level o By: sbryan (02/04/2005 - 02:36)
- I doubt Ivan and SBryan By: erlenmeyer71 (02/04/2005 - 03:43)
- I agree. I hope this doesn't By: sbryan (02/04/2005 - 04:39)
- I doubt Ivan and SBryan By: erlenmeyer71 (02/04/2005 - 03:43)
- A wedge By: Spiritboi (12/03/2005 - 23:33)
- sexual idolatry By: 1beggar (13/03/2005 - 01:27)
- "homosexual relationships" By: paynedaniel (29/06/2005 - 04:28)
- sexual idolatry By: guest (27/03/2005 - 19:18)
- the place of homosexuality in the faith By: guest (28/03/2005 - 14:44)
- sexual idolatry By: 1beggar (13/03/2005 - 01:27)
- Slavery and Self Control. By: Alario (08/03/2005 - 02:19)
- Gays are not madder or badder than anybody else By: paulhartigan (25/03/2005 - 06:38)
- Sodomising the Body of Christ By: (01/04/2005 - 17:37)
- The word "Sodom" By: paynedaniel (29/06/2005 - 04:24)
- Bringing it down a notch By: erlenmeyer71 (01/04/2005 - 22:56)
- Prostitution = Homosexuality? I'm not convinced. By: sbryan (02/04/2005 - 01:17)
- A Hateful Subject Line By: sbryan (01/04/2005 - 17:50)
- Full disclosure By: erlenmeyer71 (28/03/2005 - 16:13)
- Sodomising the Body of Christ By: (01/04/2005 - 17:37)
- "What do the scriptures say?" By: sbryan (08/03/2005 - 07:04)
- Theology of Love By: asserhed (08/03/2005 - 10:07)
- Gays are not madder or badder than anybody else By: paulhartigan (25/03/2005 - 06:38)
- Paul, homosexuality and slavery By: peter wilkinson (07/03/2005 - 10:46)
- Gays in the congregation By: erlenmeyer71 (08/03/2005 - 17:26)
- Second Temple Homosexuality? By: ericboehmer (08/03/2005 - 17:09)
- Plato? By: lancebrisbois (28/06/2006 - 04:11)
- Where "from Plato" do we see By: sbryan (09/03/2005 - 20:04)
- Plato's Symposium By: ericboehmer (09/03/2005 - 20:18)
- Contrary to the Symposium Quote By: Eonasdan (05/08/2005 - 20:36)
- Now, in order to conclude tha By: sbryan (10/03/2005 - 00:54)
- Homosexuality vs. Gay People By: ericboehmer (10/03/2005 - 01:21)
- Plato's Symposium By: ericboehmer (09/03/2005 - 20:18)
- The problem of 'versus' By: asserhed (07/03/2005 - 10:40)
- Paul and social justice By: erlenmeyer71 (06/03/2005 - 23:47)
- Paul spoke from his matrix By: kiwimac (29/06/2005 - 09:02)
Slavery and Self Control.
“In the situation described, does it not seem morally more opprobrious to own slaves than to live in a homosexual relationship? Was Paul wrong about both?”
To answer simply and in order-no and no.
It is not accurate to say St. Paul had nothing to say respecting the master/slave relationship. I refer us to Ephesians 6:5-9; Colossians 3:22-4:1 and the apostle’s letter to Philemon. It is accurate to say the apostle said nothing about slaveholders incurring the wrath of God specifically, but one could make a fair case that, at least, the Christian slaveholder operated under a different set of rules as far as treatment of his/her slaves was concerned. One could infer that treatment of a slave outside those boundries would incur God’s displeasure, if not his wrath.
Consider a more instructive comparison between Jack and Fred’s slave Bill. Bill’s master is Fred and Jack’s master is Sin. Bill’s chains are imposed from without, restrain only his physical liberty and have no eternal consequences for him. Jack, on the other hand, according to the apostle, is enslaved by his own actions or choices is bound in spirit, soul and body and is in danger of eternal separation from God.
It is always interesting to see the “monogamous homosexual relationship” used as the baseline for discussion. In the abortion discussion arena it is often “the young girl raped by her father” or “the save the life of the mother” scenarios which serve as unimpeachable examples of the purity of the “cause”.
Who can argue with them?
The girl who simply for convienence is having her, third, fourth or fifth “termination” of the “products of conception” is rarely mentioned though she is legion. Almost never do we talk about a homosexual lifestyle of indiscriminate, unprotected sex that has as many as hundreds of different partners in a year.
We will readily talk about God “making” someone homosexual. But will we look at the possibility of saying to that person that, however things may or may not be, if you wish to follow Christ, according to the scriptures, you must do so as a celibate?
What of the adulterer? I have read some musings that there is a biological imperative, possibly even genetic, that “constrains” men to fertilize as many eggs as possible to extend and expand the species. What of my vow to my wife? What of your vow to your wife? What is my pastor to do if I want to continue worshipping God in our faith community, ministering, being ministered to and taking communion all the while explaining that I can’t help myself, my biological urges compel me to serial adultery?
What do the scriptures say?
Alario